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Date: Mon, 4 May 1998 19:42:45 -0500 As part of my Life Task, which I will not discuss now, I want to get the perspectives of those you who care to respond on what Truth, the Ultimate, Unchanging Truth, is. I know that sounds vague, but what I am seeking to learn is not that the Law of Gravity is Truth (it's a law and a physical plane Truth) but "your ideas" of what really matters when we speak of truth. My Funk & Wagnells Dictionary defines truth as "The state or character of being true in relation to being, knowledge or speech." There are some other definitions that relate to the physical plane and cultural definitions, but the first one is more in character with what I'm looking for. Thanks for your input. Love and Laughter :-)) Jeanne 5th Level Old Sage/Priest ET; Discrimination; Date: Mon, 04 May 1998 21:35:19 -0400 (EDT) Hi Jeanne! You know it's interesting that you should bring this up, because I've been thinking about this a lot lately. Synchronicity! Anyway, my own personal take on "the truth" is that truth is a highly relative thing for each person. There are facts and physical laws like the law of gravity (although does the law of gravity apply inside singularities like black holes? I'm way out of my element in this.), but what those facts and laws _mean_ to each person is totally different. Actually, I came to this realization in college when i was studying medieval history. Studying history is an interesting way to look at the way humans see things. You can have one action and yet 50 different ways of describing it. And because the historian can't actually see for himself what happened, he ends up trying to correlate all the different accounts. The thing that the most people agree on must be the "truth". In terms of personal truth, I think that each person puts their own truth together in an individual way. hence, what is true for me, may not be true for you. Actually, I think that's kind of the way I approach the Yarbro books. Ok, so they're flawed, but if you can corroborate what they say somewhere else than that must be the "truth". So, I guess this is a long way of saying that, on a human level, I don't think that there is an ultimate, unchanging truth. Or rather, even if there is a truth, we, as humans on the physical plane, have too many filters up to ever see it properly. We see parts, but never the whole. And, of course, this is my "truth" and others may see things totally differently! :> So, if I may ask, what is your life task? Must be pretty interesting to be asking such deep questions! --Kathy K. Date: Mon, 4 May 1998 23:05:28 EDT Dear Jeanne -- As to the great question.... I had an experience 30 years ago today, May 4th, 1968, where I got to a wonderful place. I thought it probably was like what happened to Buddha under the fig tree. I was in a place beyond all words, where it was clear that any words were inadequate. Each idle thought that passed through I observed as being profoundly true. I could see the simultaneous truth of opposing ideas (the resolution of paradoxes). It was a lot of fun, believe me! Whether this was an experience of higher centers, as Michael would call it, or some brain and nervous system effect stimulated by something in the pot I smoked that evening (I don't think there was anything added to it, and it usually didn't affect me much at all), or something else entirely, I considered when it was happening that it was like a huge "religious experience" or "epiphany" perhaps, though these terms and others like them are usually imprecise in describing whatever actually happens. The main feature of this event was that I was rediscovering a lost connection to something very big and cosmic, infinitely great, benign, beautiful, and grand. Words can't do justice to it. Part of the reconnection is that you lose the fear of dying and separation that many of us grow up with. So what is truth?....no formulation of words or ideas is close enough. It includes an awareness of the Tao, All That Is, or whatever you call it -- an experiential contact with the reality of it, as opposed to words or theories about it. It may well be true that each individual will have a unique experience of that reality. I think the book "Cosmic Consciousness" by Bucke gets into this, though I haven't read it. It seems to me that in some way, it is a state in which one is aware of the coexistence of higher planes of life that we are part of as well as the physical. It may need to have contact with what Michael calls the high mental, messianic and/or buddhaic planes. (I presume our "higher centers" are the connections with these planes.) It probably needs to have this contact happen in a way that is benevolent and integrated, as opposed to incomplete, scary, confusing and the like. Hope this is useful somehow. All the best, Ed Date: Tue, 5 May 1998 02:40:20 EDT Jeanne, I think that 'truth' is the word. Ultimate truth dilutes the value of truth and that unchanging truth is half a truth. (unless one considers the neutral of change and unchange: in which case, unchanging truth would be one third a truth? Or am I begging the math?) Just to convince Dave I'm a scholar I propose that unchanging truth equals the square root of neutral minus the square root of changing truth. Just to be safe, I agree with Kathy (single and majority POV) and I always agree with Ed (+/-=neutral). Love, from someone who often finds it hard to swallow the truth, Dan P.S.: Ed. Regarding our passion: I'm quite sure I saw the Infinite Soul jogging the other day in an extraordinary pair of pants. OK. Jeanne I was being a smarty pants. I think that truth is INSPIRATIONAL/INTELLECTUAL. To validate truth I want to remember. TRUE/FALSE/MAYBE Date: Tue, 5 May 1998 07:16:04 EDT For me it lies in the oneness, Is-ness of now. The search is inward. With
that depth comes an extraordinary connection with the external. The deeper the
inner search, the more expansive the external connection. I have had moments of
this revealed to me. This was early in my life and I was not searching for the
experience at the time. The external connection seems to be what impresses my
mind the most and this is why I feel the allure of external focus can be so
strong. And so illusive, one can get attached to the result and loose sight of
the path that led you there. Anyone have any thoughts regarding staying on the
path, in the quiet and listening in the moment? It can feel that the inner focus
is the wrong direction.. Like your mind is convinced that you are only going to
disconnect from all. And without consciousness, I can find myself grabbing for a
connection externally, in fact only pushing the external away as well as
seperating from myself.... Date: Tue, 05 May 1998 15:52:45 -0400 Jeanne wrote:
> As part of my Life Task, which I will not discuss now, I want
IMHO... Truth is what is. The moment what is isn't then it is no longer truth. The moment what isn't is then it is now truth. Objective truth only exists in the TAO. All other truth is subjective. IOW: Truth Is. -- Date: Tue, 05 May 1998 21:34:01 +0000 Hi Jeanne, What is Absolute Truth? This is one of my favourite topics, I'm afraid, so stand back! As Michael puts it, there is universal truth, world truth and personal truth. It's easy to get confused which is which, so let's clear that up first. 1. WORLD truth is what’s true about the universe on our plane, i.e. the physical environment. Things like the law of gravity, the existence of rainbows, the effects of natural selection. Our western society is founded on understanding world truth, which we perceive as objective reality. Some would say that scientific laws and observations of objective reality are "absolute truth", or as near as we can get to it. But this just isn't so, as I think we'd all agree. As Ken Wilber would put it, science looks upon the outer world with the eye of flesh and analyzes it with the eye of reason. But who's to say that any particular scientist is seeing the whole truth with total clarity? You can't ignore the role of the observer, the individual experiencer. Which leads to... 1. PERSONAL truth is what’s true for you in your experience, or me in mine. It’s a subjective thing, unique to each consciousness. It can change from moment to moment, and it’s certainly different from person to person. (what Michael calls experiential differentiation). The inner reality of the schizophrenic hearing voices in his head is just as *valid* as personal truth as that of the scientist discovering a mathematical law. All perceptions of reality are relative to the perceiver, and no-one's perceptions are more valid than anyone else's. This is a common insight after the Young cycle, I think. "Everything we see depends on how we see it." At this point, however, a lot of people leap to the wrong conclusion -- "Ah, so if truth is relative to each individual's perceptions, and if all perceptions are valid, then there can be no absolute Truth." Not so. It just means that neither world truth nor personal truth provides the whole story. 3. UNIVERSAL truth is the underlying absolute reality behind (or within) both the objective and the subjective. Ed has described this very nicely. You could say that world truth describes the rules of the game and personal truth describes the experience of playing the game. Universal truth is what’s ultimately so, game or no game. It’s what’s true of beingness itself. The absolute Truth does not change. The Tao is always the Tao. Also, while personal and world truths are always conditional -- they DEPEND upon factors like who the perceiver is, or what time of year it is -- universal Truth is unconditional and depends upon nothing. It is simply true, regardless of anyone’s perceptions, regardless of time and place. Another thing about absolute Truth is that it cannot be perceived with the eye of flesh or figured out with the eye of reason. Because it relates to pure being, it can only be experienced directly, exactly as described so beautifully by Ed in his post. “Words can't do justice to it” is one way to recognize this sort of experience. The bad news is that if you set out to have such an exprience, it’s often an epic struggle to get "beyond" all objective and subjective awareness. There’s no short cut out of your own consciousness. The good news is that we're all *already* experiencing Truth directly, because of who/what we are; it's just a matter of surrendering to it, recognizing it within our own being. There are ways of doing this, and the retreats I run provide one way. So what IS the absolute Truth? By meditating on, say, "who am I?" you can get to the underlying truth of your personal truth and thereby, with luck, spontaneously “get it”. You then find that what remains is nothing but you, your pure presence, and it is undifferentiated from All That Is. So one version of absolute Truth, if you want it in so many words, is simply: I AM. Or if you were to meditate on the meaning of life or reality to get to the Truth behind the outer world, what the Taoists called "the 10,000 things", what you’d probably discover is the oneness of All That Is, and that its nature is what we recognize as perfect Love. So another example of realized Truth is: ALL IS LOVE. There are plenty more. One of the most powerful experiences I’ve had came a day or two after I had run an Enlightenment Intensive. I wasn’t expecting it, or even looking for it, it just blasted me as I lay relaxing at home. It came out as I AM ME BEING ME AND I’M ABSOLUTELY FREE. If the physical universe and all its laws blew up today, I know that I would still exist with the capacity of choice. And if I lost my mind, or my memory, or my life, I would still exist as an essential part of the fabric of Truth. Nothing can alter that. The discovery of absolute Truth usually comes out as something like "I am" or "Love is all there is" or "I am the light" or "We are all one Mind", and they all mean the same thing, they are all recognitions of the same Truth of our ultimate being. If reality were stripped of everything that has no eternal substance, all that would be left would be “us”. Not as separate human beings, but as pure being, instances of the same Being, sparks of the same Tao, capable of experiencing each other consciously, capable of relating to one another with total love, or less if we choose to experience that. But reading these words cannot convey it as it really is. The Taoists go on about how if you call it this then you're missing out that, and it's beyond both of them anyway, but not separate from either of them. The absolute Truth simply cannot be communicated in terms that imply separation, division or differentiation, but our whole language is based on such concepts. Having said all this, I actually don't like presenting something as "the Truth", not just because it invites flames but because it's always infinitely better for people to arrive at the discovery of what ultimately Is through their own inner work, as I know from experience. Any guru who teaches what "the truth" is, and expects you to believe it, is actually laying a massive trip, implying that they "know" but you don't because you're not worthy or advanced enough or something, which is patent nonsense. Each person's own consciousness is a perfectly valid access point into Truth. B a r r y Date: Tue, 05 May 1998 21:37:34 +0000 Hi all, me again (so soon?) Thanks so much for all the feedback so far on running Michael groups/classes. Something I’d had in mind (before you guys drew my attention to so many other options!) was to start off by giving a class on, say, "Reincarnation According to Michael", then follow it up with a study group for those who want to go further with it. I hadn't foreseen the possibilities of there being any channelled input, but I can now see how that could work (thanks Victoria). Maybe I'd cover a concept in one meeting (say, life task) and get everyone to meditate and communicate on what that means for them personally, then have the channelled “answers” for each person at the next session. I guess I’d like to attract people who are not just after dry info but are willing to look at themselves, their experiences, do some inner work. (I have no qualms about handling group issues.) Also, my wife has suggested we host a get-together day for existing Michael students in the UK; invite everyone to our place one Saturday, see if anything comes of it. B a r r y Date: Tue, 05 May 1998 14:42:55 -0700 Hello Ed,
| Dear Dick -- What I was getting at was that in comparison with the
I guess I tend to disagree with your position here. The Infinite soul, according to Shepherd in »Journey«,(§1) is a reunited Cadre, and as such has consciousness that can be communicated with. And communication among discarnate consciousness(es?) is more common/intimate/forthcoming than we experience here.(§2) So I see no reason Michael would not be able to have knowledge of reunited Cadre/s who might choose to manifest as Infinite soul/s. Cheers, [--------------------<*>--------------------] §1 - An infinite soul is a representative of a reunited cadre from one of §2 - »Those on higher planes are not totally unified yet, but we do not Each consciousness is evolving individually, yet is connected to the --- JS1 = »The Journey of Your Soul« V1 / Shepherd Hoodwin In marking quoted material, the marks »text« represent italics. The following table shows nominal markings for each source - JS1 = Author »Edited Michael« === Date: Tue, 05 May 1998 14:43:39 -0700
| From: Ed
To me, that last sentence states a *very* interesting concept, one that I've not seen mentioned in any of the Michael literature I've read. Shepherd, do you have knowledge of this? If not, can you check with Michael? Cheers, Date: Tue, 5 May 1998 18:36:42 EDT What a coincidence I was thinking of the inmutable truths and of the personal
truths and i was realicing that mystics and like Jesus and other masters where
able to defy the inmutable truths and laws like gravity and (jesus walking on
water and of time and of space ) Date: Wed, 6 May 1998 00:28:40 EDT If I post something on Truth and get it wrong, can the Tao sue me for libel? Thanks to Ed and Barry for their posts. I often suspected truth was only approachable through the type of experiences they described (a type of experience I've always longed for). There is/was a book that compiled just such experiences, hundreds of them. I think it was called The Common Experience. It was tiring reading, as you can imagine. The book grouped the experiences by the types of revelations the people gained during those states (no time, all is love, etc.). Still, I don't feel it in my bones that there is one stable, constant universal truth. God sparked us off, right? And we will all re-unite with him/it. And all of this takes place outside of time. But still, doesn't that involve change? He was all that was, then - by creating us - created the paradoxical state of separation/no separation, only to have it come back to oneness with our so-called return to the Tao. Maybe it is not change since it is outside of time. But I don't yet understand how change can happen without time passing. And if God changes, how can he be a constant universal truth? I suppose there could be universal truth even if God is evolving. That then would be the Truth, right? That the all-that -is constantly changing. This is kind of a different description of truth. Not the kind you could look up in a 25-year-old encyclopedia to read about how it was and will always be, but more a defintion similar to the way we speak of the laws of nature. Gravity makes things do this... Absolute truth functions like this... I suspect, through my reading, the answer is that there is an unchanging constant, (perfection, love and compassion) outside of time. And outside of lower center comprehension. It must be beyond words, also, for those who have experienced it in the higher centers. That is what they all report. On a slightly different note, I've noticed that the higher you go with truths, the more paradoxical they become. Ed, can you say anything about how paradoxes resolve? I've wondered about this for a long time. Truth, Justice and the American Way, Date: Wed, 6 May 1998 01:53:55 EDT I agree with all of you on versions and perspectives of truth but now I'm thinking that truth is merely the description, knowledge, understanding or thought of what is. What is to me is the physical. How it feels is the emotional. Am I missing the point? Do we not agree as Michael students that we have the emotional, intellectual, physical and that the positive poles are Love, Truth, and Beauty? I might have to be straightened out on this one. Dick, I do not agree that any one fragment, cadre, cadence, entity or any finite division or group holds, houses or represents exclusively the Infinite Soul. I propose that your heart (every single one of ours) knows more about the coming of the Infinite Soul than Michael for Michael is not subject to time. Michael might know the purpose of the Infinite Soul. I have heard the Orinda channels say that the Infinite Soul might come around 2030 or so in more than one body (possibly all three of the buddhaic, messianic and krishna manifestations) but the Michaels were not committed to any specific time as if timimg was dependant upon the desire or choosing of all of us. I suggest that Michael is waiting for us to tell Michael when the Infinite Soul has come. Joya suggests that Mother Meer is a vehicle for the Infinite Soul. I agree. I believe every one of us by definition has an agreement with the Infinite Soul and that that agreement is a specific act at a specific time. It is the common thread that connects all our souls (our infinite souls) together. All of us do channel the Infinite Soul. As a suggestive test how 'bout a knot the size of a golf ball in your upper stomach (3rd chakra) that tuggs on your voice box (lower 5th chakra). I believe in an infinite number of souls in an infinite number of universes and that connection of them all is the Infinite Soul. When Ed talks about the Infinite Soul I get all tingly because he inspires me to join with him in beckoning the connection of the Infinite Soul. I want to feel that yank or tug saying "time to come home. Time to shed Dan and join you all and be God consciousness" I hope this rings true for you. Dan Date: Wed, 06 May 1998 01:29:55 -0700 Dan,
| From: Dan
Available Michael literature (books) documents the Infinite soul manifesting in a physical body from time to time. And Shepherd's channeling indicates it is a reunited Cadre that manifests as the Infinite soul.
| I propose that your heart (every single one of ours) knows more about
Just because Michael is "not subject" to time does not mean they are not aware of time as experienced on the physical plane.
| I have heard the Orinda channels say that the Infinite Soul might come
I disagree. Conditions on Earth will undoubtedly affect when the manifestations will occur, but I am quite sure Michael will know before they do. Whether Michael chooses to reveal that to us is another matter.
| Joya suggests that Mother Meer is a vehicle for the Infinite Soul. I
I think you may be using a different definition of the Infinite soul than that documented in the literature. Cheers, Date: Wed, 6 May 1998 09:43:18 EDT Dear Dick -- I still disagree....while Michael may say and even know that the Infinite is a manifestation of a reunited cadre, and while lots of communication happens at all those levels, and the communication, being above our physical plane verbal level would be much more complete......Michael still says (I lack citations) that there are things they don't know and are still learning about and growing into, and I prseume that the ways of the Infinite Soul are among these. Even if the ways of the Infinite Soul could be reduced to social science at some high level of metaphysics, I doubt that Michael would grasp it at this point. Further, if they could understand the social science of Infinity, then I presume there would be other channeled entities who would likewise, and I don't have the feeling that this is the case. All the best, Ed Date: Wed, 6 May 1998 10:02:58 EDT Dear Gwendy -- About the question of how all these miraculous things happen or don't happen: We simultaneously exist on many planes besides the physical one. In some way we are able to place our focus in one or more of these planes at any given time. Usually we are focused in the physical when we are in the normal waking state. At the same time we are existing and participating in the other planes "in the background" with the focus set so that we are not distracted. In fact, if we walk around in the physical with our attention elsewhere we crash into things and in general mess up our participation in the physical. In the physical we have the collective agreements or "rules" of physics and gravirty, etc. The higher planes have different operating principles. When Jesus or other ascended masters interact with us, what happens is that somehow their high vibration causes us to change our focus among the planes, and often without our realizing it. So in their space, which we have chosen to join in, the physical and metaphysical rules are different from our usual dense physicality and miracles can happen. All these things are true, just as whatever happens in dreams is true while it is happening. But when we come back to our usual waking state we can't fly or walk on water, and we may well decide that the miracles or the dreams were just some fantasy or delusion. So the miracles are both true and untrue, just depending on how you arrange your beliefs to adjust for the different planes. All the best, Ed Date: Wed, 06 May 1998 14:05:01 +0000 Where is God?
In a certain suburban neighborhood, there were two brothers, 8 and 10 years old, who were exceedingly mischievous. Whatever went wrong in the neighborhood, it turned out they had had a hand in it. Their parents were at their wits' end trying to control them. Hearing about a priest nearby who worked with delinquent boys, the mother suggested to the father that they ask the priest to talk with the boys. The father replied, "Sure, do that before I kill them!" The mother went to the priest and made her request. He agreed, but said he wanted to see the younger boy first and alone. So the mother sent him to the priest. The priest sat the boy down across a huge, impressive desk he sat behind. For about five minutes they just sat and stared at each other. Finally, the priest pointed his forefinger at the boy and asked, "Where is God?" The boy looked under the desk, in the corners of the room, all around, but said nothing. Again, louder, the priest pointed at the boy and asked, "Where is God?" Again the boy looked all around but said nothing. A third time, in a louder, firmer voice, the priest leaned far across the desk and put his forefinger almost to the boy's nose, and asked, "Where is God?" The boy panicked and ran all the way home. Finding his older brother, he dragged him upstairs to their room and into the closet, where they usually plotted their mischief. He finally said, "We are in BIIIIG trouble." The older boy asked, "What do you mean, BIIIIG trouble?" His brother replied, "God is missing and they think we did it." =============================== Date: Wed, 06 May 1998 22:38:14 +0800 PJ wrote on 5/5/98 11:16 am:
>For me it lies in the oneness, Is-ness of now. The search is inward. With that
PJ said just about all that I can say. :-) So I just want to comment that, while I have not experienced anything mystical, a few short moments of inner silence and serenity showed me that *looking* for Truth may just be overshooting the mark. The Truth is, external and internal, or not for both cases. The Truth is. Is everywhere. As what I wrote in my tagline, perhaps stop looking fob Truth and you may what you seek presented to you in goed platter. "Seek, and ye shall find". But take a break, and you just may have found what you seek. =====!===== J J Tan Date: Wed, 6 May 1998 11:01:42 -0400 I have seen reference to Mother Meer on the list a couple of times now. Can
anyone tell me who she is? Or about her? Sincerely, Date: Wed, 6 May 1998 11:22:02 EDT Dear John -- How do paradoxes resolve? Your awareness by some amazing means gets to a place where you see the resolution of it. Lots of spiritual practices are designed to get one there. The common thread seems to be that hard effort doesn't do it; it is a relaxation or surrendering that does. How does change happen without time? What many channeled sources say is that the farther away you get from the physical the less time is like it is in the physical. You could say that it becomes "timing", where there is "before" and "after" but no "how much" before and after. Things do change, but there is no clock to keep track of elapsed time. All the best, Ed Date: Wed, 6 May 1998 11:35:51 EDT Dear JJ -- About discovering the truth not with effort but by letting go, I think you have got it just right. A lot of the traditional spiritual paths or practices are built around the belief that it takes many years of very hard work. The seeker gets more and more heavily, oh-so-seriously into the work until nothing else has any meaning at all. The effort gets harder and harder, and the teacher keeps pushing for more focus on it. Finally, surrender or letting go happens and one is in the truth and all is very wonderful. But equally so, all is very wonderful right now, and one doesn't necessarily have to go through all that hard work. It may be an experience we all do in at least one lifetime, but it isn't necessarily needed more than once. Many people have bought into belief systems that say they "should" earnestly follow some spiritual practice for many hard years in order to be happy. One could also just be happy now. All the best, Ed Date: Wed, 06 May 1998 19:15:41 +0000 Hi all, I just read in the newspapers here that Lloyds (Britain’s leading insurance market) is “turning to astrology amid fears that a planetary conjuntion in 2000 could force huge payouts. Some underwriters believe the phenomenon could herald a spate of worlwide natural disasters.” The conjunction (in which Mercury, Venus, Mars, Jupiter and Saturn will line up with the Sun and the Moon) will be in early May 2000 and is predicted to wreak havoc (earthquakes, volcanoes, tidal waves, etc) due to gravitational stresses. Anybody have any further insights into this? B a r r y Date: Wed, 6 May 1998 17:11:02 -0500 I cannot thank all of you enough for all of the perspectives you have given me regarding "Truth". Ed and Barry, if I were seeking a Guru, I'd split my time between the two of you; Dan you pointed out something I find very important- that adjectives water down truth; John and JJ are looking within (I agree), Ken Broom says so much with such incredible simplicity (I sigh with envy), And to answer Kathy's question (in part), I am trying to learn about as many different "perspectives" on the Truth of the Tao as I can. I already know for myself, from my perspective, what Truth is. For me it is the Unconditional Love of the Tao. Having been the recipient of it for "one brief shining moment" in this lifetime, I knew instantaneously that this is what we all search for throughout this physicality and unless we reach our higher centers it is a rare experience indeed. And while I have not yet experienced it again, it has given my life a meaning that I had not known prior to the experience. It often gives me the desire to hurry up, learn the lessons, get through here and get back to that wholeness, to revel in that glorious feeling I had. We do a great service to our "Whole" by coming here to bring back life experiences for knowingness, because we give up for a time (and when here in the physical, it seems like a very long time), the only thing that really matters. Please understand, I'm not asking you to believe this, and it did not come from a Channel, just the expression of the life task did. But I know that I know this, for myself. And now I must take all of your perspectives and try to incorporate them with mine and see "How Much More" I know that I know. All of the Love I can Muster, as unconditionally as it is possible for me, here and now, to give to all of you. Jeanne 5th Level Old Sage/Priest ET; Discrimination; Date: Wed, 06 May 1998 17:06:54 -0700 Hi Sharon,
> I have seen reference to Mother Meer on the list a couple of times now. Can
Mother Meera is reported to be the first of 5 Infinite Souls who will all be here by around 2025 (so I have heard from some Michael channels) and she's in Germany. I'm taking my birth-mom Sheila to Germany next month for "healing," at Mother Meera's darshan, and if this healing is not in body, at least in spirit..... I think Joya Pope is over there right now at Mother Meera's darshan. Joya told me how it felt to be there in Mother Meera's presence, and when I found out Sheila had cancer and how far advanced it is, I thought, she's going to need a miracle, and I thought of taking her to Mother Meera (among other things.) I don't know if she does these kind of healings but from what I understand the real healing comes from within each of ourselves, and that healers act as catalysts. I hope it's going to help, but if not, it is OK, at least I found Sheila and got to know her for a little while while she is living and did everything I could to try to assist her, as much as she would allow..... Love, Date: Wed, 6 May 1998 19:19:54 -0700 (PDT) you wrote:
> The conjunction (in which Mercury, Venus, Mars, Jupiter and Saturn will
I haven't heard of 2000 being a problem but have heard about 2002 and
2012 being a little strange from non Michael channels. Supposedly the earth has
a biorhythm that is 20 years long. I have wondered why Michael hasn't mentioned
2002 and 2012. Of course I am assuming the other source is accurate about those
years but who knows. My perception of Michael is they don't want to generate
fear. I once asked Michael about a non Michael being who is channeled who
discusses fear generating ideas about the future. Michael normally would expound
on things when I asked questions but this one time their answer was one word. I
think they didn't want to talk about the fear based ideas. Date: Wed, 6 May 1998 22:23:39 EDT Dear Barry -- There is a book "5/5/2000" by Richard(?) Noone that makes this argument. I wouldn't worry about it. There was an extreme planetary alignment a few months ago and another one in 1982, which inspired a book by Gribbin, called "The Jupiter Effect". Nothing happened in either case. The flaw in their reasoning, IMHO, is that if this 2000 alignment could cause all this massive destruction, then innumerable similar alignments must have happened in the past, but where is the destruction from those past alignment events? All the best, Ed Date: Wed, 6 May 1998 22:45:29 EDT In a message dated 98-05-06 22:24:53 EDT, Ed writes:
Dear Barry -- There is a book "5/5/2000" by Richard(?) Noone that makes this
It's just plain silliness. An old music teacher of mine who now does astronomical research through JPL has been joking about these prophecies for years. But the thing to remember is.....OUCH.....something just struck me on the head? Oh, my God! THE SKY IS FALLING! THE SKY IS FALLING!!!!! ;-p Dave Date: Thu, 7 May 1998 01:59:57 EDT Dick, I admit my illiteracy for I have not read Shepherd's book yet. I have met Shepherd and think the world of him and found him to be most sincere and loving. I am embarrassed to say that I have not read but a fraction of the Michael books. I looked at MMFM pp. 202 & 203 in the '86 edition and found to my surprise that the Infinite Soul is the bearing of the Universal Truth that Barry was talking about and the IS that Ken discussed. The text is as follows: "THE INFINITE SOUL, BEING OF THE SEVEN NATURE, BRINGS THE LOGOS TO BEAR DURING ITS MANIFESTATION. WHEN THE INFINITE SOUL IS EXTANT ON THE PHYSICAL PLANE, IT DOES NOT SO MUCH TEACH AS EXIST IN THE STATE OF CULMINATION THAT IS THE WAY THE PHYSICAL PLANE EXPERIENCES THE PRESENCE OF THE LOGOS. WHAT WE OFFER IS TEACHING, WHAT THE INFINITE SOUL PROVIDES IS UNIVERSAL TRUTH." I think the Logos is the truth (Why did I have to convince Jeanne that adjectives dilute the meaning of truth? Sometimes I corner myself.) Logos is the order of things, thought, the word, to speak, the word of God (Webster's 2nd ed.) So, Dick, maybe I'm wrong and I've confused Universal Truth with the Infinite Soul. I have a strong concern similar to what Barry expressed of someone else holding the truth that I want. I want direct access to the Infinite Soul. I want everyone to have direct access to the Infinite Soul. I take the Gnostic POV rather than the Orthodox of hierarchical channels. Maybe my lesson is to accept hierarchy. I don't want the Infinite Soul to be exclusively from a Cadre or Entity because then I fear that it could be excludable. I will try to be open to the idea that Michael will know when the Infinite Soul is coming and that that information will be conveyed accurately, timely and affordably. Now Dick, would you be willing to humor me with the notion that you might find yourself in the middle of some day dropping all that no longer matters because you've just had a blinding vision that your quest is to call us all up to announce that the Infinite Soul has come? I will accept email. Dan P.S.: Jeanne must have channeled the Infinite Soul. Date: Thu, 7 May 1998 05:12:26 EDT In a message dated 98-05-06 18:14:14 EDT, Jeanne writes:
I already know for myself, from my perspective, what Truth
This is one aspect of New Age philosophy that always bothers me. It seems that so many people want to just finish and get out. Obviously, all is choice, but it simply makes no sense to choose a physical existence, and then spend the majority of our time trying to free ourselves of it's chains. We are not shackled to our bodies. We chose to be here. Living in the physical is a privilege. It's a wondrous gift. As beautiful as a mother's caress. In other words, the most glorious feeling that we can experience is life itself! As I grow older I've found myself enjoying very eye-opening higher center experiences through music, poetry, art, and one thing that I've found consistently prevalent is that these joyful states of unbridled elation don't appear after prolonged states of deep meditation, but from the tangible, corporeal attributes of being physical. When I lovingly embrace the joyful feeling of just being alive, this is when I feel balanced and in harmony with everything. Why should we have feelings of separateness from the Tao? It's all around us everywhere we look. It's in a glorious multi-colored sunset, it's in the gentle murmur of a mountain stream, it's in a puppie's eyes, and it's in a lover's smile. It's everything and everyone. I'm not saying that the journey of physical existence is not without its struggles and pain, but even these obstacles allow you to understand what's true for your soul, and the predicate of all of this is embracing the journey you have chosen for yourself, one of the greatest adventures in the universe -- life. Dave Date: Thu, 7 May 1998 07:53:54 -0400 Dear Barry, --Sharon Date: Thu, 07 May 1998 18:18:44 +0000 Hi all, Just to clarify a couple of points about universal truth and the Infinite Soul. Dan says:
I want direct access to the Infinite Soul.
Well, perhaps you mean direct access to universal truth, and the conscious experience of it. In which case, you already have it. Any of us can experience universal truth, perceive and know the Tao itself. Consciousness is consciousness, so none of us is excluded. But our access to that *state* of consciousness is fragile and brief, because of our limited evolution. We can only take so much love, truth and ecstasy in one go! But as Jeanne can obviously attest, even a single moment of experiencing the Absolute is the moment of a lifetime. Once you know What Is, you can't un-know it (try as chief feature will). I think it stays with us as a deep knowingness forever. While such experiences are brief for us, the Infinite soul (or a cadre of the higher planes) is a being that has reached the evolutionary level at which that consciousness is *stabilized*. The Infinite soul, when incarnate, is an embodiment of a level or state of consciousness that directly experiences universal truth. As Michael has also put it "The Infinite Soul perceives the Tao itself." He or she "brings the Logos to bear", the Logos being the knowledge of universal truth. But just as an Old soul can experience the state of consciousness of an Infant, Baby, Young or Mature soul yet still remain an Old soul, so can any of us experience the state of consciousness of a Transcendental or even Infinite soul without waiting to become one. You certainly don't need "permission", or a secret code known only to integrated entities and cadres. There is no hierarchy of access at work. All beings are equal, no matter what their level of consciousness. Nor do you need an Infinite soul living next door to "make it happen" it for you. Jesus and Buddha didn't "make" anyone enlightened; our state of consciousness is our own affair. But the presence of an incarnate Infinite Soul provides a living example for all to see -- something that those with "eyes to see and ears to hear" can't miss, guaranteed to remind us something of our true nature. All Infinite souls reveal the same thing: the Truth/Tao/Kingdom of Heaven is within you. B a r r y Date: Thu, 7 May 1998 17:29:38 -0500
> From: Dave
That is your perspective Dave and I honor it, but when my Essence brought me that moment of unconditional love the feeling was beyond anything I had ever felt before. Yes we did choose to be here and as one ages (chronologically) the "been there, done that" feeling begins to take hold for many of us. In a channeling that Caris Turpen did for me, I made the comment to the Michaels that I was tired and at times felt a real longing to be finished here. I do not deny that feeling. The Michaels replied that it is a common feeling for "old souls". We've played the game so many times...we don't "want" to make new karma, we want to pay off the old...we find our joy in the natural world, rather than in the world of "the game". The Michaels also said I had done more than one grand cycle. Maybe that has some bearing on the feeling.
> As I grow older I've found myself enjoying very eye-opening higher center
Yes it's a sunset, you have lovers fine, I'm old and married and the "last"
thing I want to do is play that game again! I'm looking for Devas and I don't
care if the President, the Speaker of The House and the King of wherever there
are still kings, play tootsies with all of the available women of the world.
> I'm not saying that the journey of physical existence is not without its
Been there, done that. Jeanne Date: Thu, 7 May 1998 16:24:50 -0700 (PDT)
>Been there, done that.
Amen that is exactly how I feel. I have heard that when the essence twin
cycles off it tends to pull us off and that is where I am. I was told by a non
Michael channel I will be given an opportunity to leave the physical plane which
I assume is true for most anyone contemplating cycling off. I find the physical
plane a lot of work even if it is beautiful. Date: Thu, 7 May 1998 19:46:24 -0400 Dear Dave and all, Gosh,that was a real keeper And really,aren't theses bodies just great! its great to be back in the group again, Date: Thu, 7 May 1998 22:20:34 EDT Dick, Barry, Ted, Thanks for all the info. I am grateful for a safe place to reveal my misunderstanding or misinterpretation so that I may know more what is. Dave and Jeanne, I appreciate where both of you are coming. I desire and tire of my body and this world daily. Thanks, Dan Date: Thu, 07 May 1998 22:18:16 -0500 oh! are we talking about this Young Soul Society again? this word "society" is interesting. i never really grasped that concept, fortunately. so anyway, while i was busy reading winnie-the-pooh AGAIN, as it is by far better than any of these michael books anyway, i couldn't help but notice how Youth Destroying this Young Soul Society thing really is. anyone who buys into it winds up all old and tired and weary and complains that there is nothing New and Bright and Shiny anymore. now that's no fun. and what's the deal with all these big concepts? i am constantly assaulted by "adult" concepts such as "stress management" and "spiritual fulfillment" and even shorter words such as "society". children don't have these concepts. children don't worry about how to find "spiritual fulfillment". they just *exist* and are somehow mysteriously fulfilled. they somehow have found something in the Here and Now instead of looking Down the Road, Elsewhere, Above or wherever people look for this other concept called Happiness. hmm. i can't help but feel that if your motto is "been there done that" than you
*must* be an adult. you probably have an agenda of some sort. perhaps a list of
things you need to do? oh! i know! a list of things that you have *already*
done!! you are actively being productive. seeking fulfillment, perhaps? you can
come play with me. i have some New Bright Shiny toys with nary an adult concept.
somehow i manage to get by. i haven't yet been arrested by the Young Soul
Society Police. certainly children must be public enemy #1. javex. (eternal newbie) Date: Fri, 8 May 1998 05:59:38 EDT In a message dated 98-05-07 18:33:00 EDT, Jeanne writes:
That is your perspective Dave and I honor it, but when my Essence brought
Well, I think many of us here can empathize with your sentiments about feeling burnt out. I think some have even refered to it as "Old soul disease." I know I certainly enjoy my lethargic existence. In fact, I once had a girlfriend (yes, it's hard to believe, isn't it?) who demanded to see my birth certificate for proof that I was alive. Seriously, I greatly enjoy not finding myself emersed in the 9-5 grind, and I don't miss doing mind-numbing work where the most stimulating intellectual exchange with other people is, "would you like fries with that, sir?" ;-p However, there are more paths to explore than the ones I just mentioned. I like to be optimistic and believe that life isn't just one long prison sentence that revolves around the hope that there'll be one big jail break at the end of it all. Too often, from what I've read and seen in many New Age forums, there's a tendency to strive for spiritual growth so tenaciously that people begin to alienate themselves from the one constant that we all come here to experience -- being physical.
The Michaels also said I had done more than one
Could be. I'm sure you have done many grand cycles. If memory serves correct, I think the average grand cycle for sentients on this planet is somewhere around four, and the grand cycles for Michael students is much higher. (Scholars please correct me on this.) Of course, the Michaels channeled me as having 75 grand cycles, which means I'm LEGALLY DEAD. ;-p Seriously, I think Shepherd channeled me currently incarnating on my 14th grand cycle, which I thought was a great excuse to justify my sloth-like lifestyle. Though I'm sorry to report, I've yet to notice any trace of enhanced wisdom from my experience, unless you would count those confusing instances where I find myself standing in front of a mirror for a half-hour, desperately trying to remember where I've seen myself before. ;-p I hate it when that happens, though, I have a sneaky suspicion that Dan can relate. Heh heh...
Yes it's a sunset, you have lovers fine, I'm old and married and the "last"
Wasn't that a country-western song? {Singing merrily} "I'm looking for Devas in all the wrong places...Lookin' for Devas, just lookin' for Devas?" Okay, maybe not.
care if the President, the Speaker of The House and the King of wherever
Now that brings up an interesting point. How many believe that President Bill
Clinton's nude, lifeless body will be found in a cheap motel down south
somewhere?
I want to find my higher self and be in constant contact with that part of myself and all of the
Music past tense??? Sacrilege!!!!!!!! If I were a Monty Python character, I'd
fart in your general direction, and tell you that your mother was a hamster and
your father smelt of elderberry. Or something like that...;-p
All of the "Games We Play" are to learn lessons. I have new and what I consider
Sounds like some good, empowering lessons.
So I am weary of the game and as you said "that's my choice".
New Age is that fervent wish we have when someone mentions that there's a
gleam in our eye, and it turns out to be just the sun hitting our bifocals.
It is old soul feeling and if you haven't experienced it yet,
I agree. I find little use for the young soul game of materialism, but one thing I've observed is that if I try to separate myself from individuals who I feel are seemingly less evolved, I quickly find myself separating myself from my own evolution. I think the slogan to use in this instance might be, "what you resist, persists." Another way to look at it is the old Sethian concept that says, "the way you view the world is the way you will experience it." And yet another way to look at it is, "if MICHAEL was alive today, he'd be desperately scratching at the inside of his coffin..." Uh....Just kidding.
Been there, done that.
So have I, and I can't wait to do it again. ;-p Well, just as long as there's air conditioning, Ben&Jerry's, electric toothbrushes, and faster modems for my computer. Dave - When I'm feeling down, I like to whistle. It makes the neighbor's dog run to the end of his chain and gag himself. :-) Date: Fri, 8 May 1998 06:17:15 EDT In a message dated 98-05-07 19:47:52 EDT, M'Ixchel writes:
its great to be back in the group again,
Nice to have you back. But has anyone informed you of the new initiation rites for this list? No???? Uh, oh..... Dave :-) Date: Fri, 8 May 1998 06:25:19 EDT In a message dated 98-05-07 23:31:41 EDT, you write:
so anyway, while i was busy reading winnie-the-pooh AGAIN,
Winnie the Pooh??? Yes, the willy-nilly-silly old bear rules. :-) Dave - I'm just a little black rain cloud. Pay no attention to little me. Subject: New initiation rites... Alright Dave...let me have it Do I have to stand on my head with two different colored jelly beans up my nose while singing twinkle twinkle little star? If so....(here it comes...) "been there done that" (just this morning with my kids before my cup of hot chocolate piled high with whipped cream (or did I just imagine it all...hummmm) But it was such an enriching experience I'm willing to do it again just for you and this list....besides its different every time I do it because I'm in a new moment and the possibilties for ways of experiencing it are endless.....ahhh the bliss of creating my own reality So whats it gonna be....I'm game M'Ixchel... from hell (and every other place where interesting experiences are to be had) light dark old young its all just a jelly bean waiting to be tasted Are we having fun yet??? Date: Fri, 08 May 1998 14:39:03 -0700 Hi Ed,
| Dear Dick -- I still disagree....while Michael may say and even know
Agreed. This is mentioned at least once in Yarbro.
| and I prseume that the ways of the Infinite Soul are among these. Even
I don't think Michael has to know much in the way of how a reunited Cadre functions or operates in order to communicate with them/it and learn when/if they/it will manifest as the Infinite soul. If we can communicate with Michael I should think they can communicate with a reunited Cadre.
| Further, if they could understand the social science of Infinity, then I
Again I don't think they would need to know that much about a reunited Cadre
in order to know that they will manifest as the Infinite soul. Cheers, Date: Fri, 08 May 1998 14:39:30 -0700 Dan,
| Dick,
I have not yet had the pleasure but don't doubt your assessment.
| I am embarrassed to say that I have not read but a fraction of the Michael books.
Judging by your quote below, those you have read are IMO some of the major ones. And I strongly suggest you get and read »Journey«; you won't be disappointed.
| I looked at MMFM pp. 202 & 203 in the '86 edition and found to my
Michael's definition of the Logos is in M1.(§1)
| So, Dick, maybe I'm wrong and I've confused Universal Truth with the
Huh? Are you saying truth is finite?
| I want direct access to the Infinite Soul. I want everyone to have
As described in the literature, when a reunited Cadre manifests in a physical body it is referred to as the Infinite soul and is a representative of the Tao. If the Infinite soul exists per se while not manifested in a physical body is undocumented AFAIK.
| I take the Gnostic POV rather than the Orthodox of hierarchical channels.
Being not overly well-read (outside of Michael), I am not familiar with either of these.
| Maybe my lesson is to accept hierarchy.
The only hierarchy in the Michael teachings I am aware of, other than planes of existence and that the Tao is all there is so encompasses everything, is a sort of hierarchy brought about by the fragmentation that occurs as part of the process of setting up physical plane cycles.
| I don't want the Infinite Soul to be exclusively from a Cadre or Entity
Again I think this is a problem in semantics; I think you probably want a term other than "Infinite soul."
| I will try to be open to the idea that Michael will know when the
I think that is a safe bet.
| and that that information will be conveyed accurately, timely and affordably.
As I mentioned before, that is another matter entirely, being of course, Michael's choice.
| Now Dick, would you be willing to humor me with the notion that you
Heh! I seriously doubt that I would be the one to bring such news to the masses. :^) Cheers, [--------------------===============<*>===============--------------------] §1 - To the Greeks, the Logos was the controlling force of the universe. --- M1 = »Messages From Michael« / Chelsea Quinn Yarbro In marking quoted material, the marks »text« represent italics. The following table shows nominal markings for each source - M1 = Heavily edited Michael »Other« === Date: Fri, 08 May 1998 14:39:54 -0700 Dan,
| Dick, Barry, Ted,
That, IMO, is what this list and all of our interaction is about - to learn, to experience, to grow. I think Barry said it more eloquently than I did in my response to your last. Cheers, Date: Fri, 08 May 1998 18:59:39 -0400 Hi, my name is Lucy. I read your messages every day. I writing because I need your prayers of healing for a young man named Derek. Last year, he was in a car accident and has been in a coma ever since. Please help Derek. Also, does Micheal say anything about what happens to the person or his/her
soul when they are in a coma. I want to relay this message/information to his
mother. She goes to the hospital everyday to talk with him. Thank you Lucy Date: Fri, 08 May 1998 21:55:56 -0700 From Chapter 3: The Truth of the Matter, "The World According to Lori," Vol.I, 1998. ;-D
> Try spending one hour (much less one day) trying to mentally
Know why you can't do it? Because unconditional love is not a mental state. It is a state of being, a wholeness within yourself, and when you are there, there is no need to project anything. You automatically emanate unconditional Love. I usually don't talk much about the following because I don't like to make myself as some kind of "healer," because to me it feels rather arrogant to say that, but I do see myself as being a kind of facillitator for some people. When I'm doing energy work with them, I'm bringing in my higher-self and guides and I try to get my own fears and CF's out of the way as much as possible, and trust this inner guidance. The Love that comes through is just incredible, and it's like, I would like to stay that way all day....But it does burn me out, big time. When I'm not careful enough I get sick with colds or the flu within a few days. The people I've worked with feel that Love too, and spiritually and emotionally at least, it heals something, brings something they lost or gave up on back to them, and I don't know why or how and sometimes I'm just thankful that I don't know the mental intellectual part of it....Can you believe it? Me--the analyzer of everything, glad that this Love doesn't need explanation, that it just IS, that it brings joy and life where it had been lost, and even some of it is selfish I admit, but that Love is there, it always is, and to bring it DOWN HERE, into this life, into the hearts of people, THAT is the goal. I don't know how to explain it but you just DO it. The only thought that is required is the one that lets you surrender to it. Please never underestimate your potential. Love and Agape to All, Date: Sat, 9 May 1998 03:53:13 EDT In a message dated 98-05-09 00:51:06 EDT, Lori writes:
From Chapter 3: The Truth of the Matter, "The World According to Lori," Vol.I, 1998.
Okay, is anyone else drooling to see the rest of Lori's chapters? Hey, sis! I expect to have an autographed copy of this book by Monday, or whenever the grunions start running. Either way will do. ;-p Dave Date: Sat, 09 May 1998 01:23:23 -0700
| From: Dave
Interesting way to put it! I would guess it is a very common belief that we are here to suffer because of some unknown external force. It was from Michael through the teaching that I learned that this physical journey is purposeful, by choice, for the experience.
| New Age is that fervent wish we have when someone mentions that there's a
I can relate to those sentiments. :^) Cheers, Date: Sat, 9 May 1998 08:52:20 EDT Dear Javex, Have you tried the Teletubbies yet? Great antidote for the weary and us kiddos love it. Martha Date: Sat, 09 May 1998 17:44:48 -0700 Hi everybody, In my latest quest in search of cures for what ails us, someone told me about a cure for my son's allergies. I'm trying it out and so far I'm amazed with the results. I'm also amazed to discover all these chronic problems I have may be due to allergies that I didn't know I had as well. http://www.naet.com This is Nambudripad's Allergy Elimination Techniques. A few months ago our pediatrician finally referred my son to an allergy specialist because he's had so many sinus infections, asthma, and eczema all over his body. They did a skin test on him and determined he was allergic to corn, milk, eggs, fish, peanuts, citrus fruit, and I knew of a couple other things that didn't even show up positive on their skin test. All they could tell me to do was to keep him away from these foods (which, if you read the labels on everything you buy, you'd notice it's very difficult to avoid a lot of the things my son's allergic to in processed foods.) Also they wanted us to keep his room free of dust mites, keep the cats out, and get rid of all my plants in the house, etc. So we have done this in the last few months, and his skin cleared up, but that was all. He had his adenoids out the other day, along with having the tubes in his ears replaced. This is supposed to help him breathe better and prevent ear infections. Well, it does, to an extent..... Anyway, since I found this NAET practitioner in our area, my son's been in for two accupressure treatments so far, to cure his egg and dairy allergies. He ate a plate full of eggs a few days ago, and today he had yogurt and cheese, and I am so amazed--he got no rash! That's what proves it for me--if he can eat something he's allergic to that he got treated for by NAET, and then it doesn't produce a rash within a few hours, I think it's really working. I have to take him in for more treatments as they only treat one type of food at a time. But, they say it's a *permanent* treatment and I certainly hope so! Last time we were there I asked to have myself tested for allergies and I guess I'm not surprised to find I'm allergic to a lot of the same things my son is, but my body just has different reactions. The muscle test NAET uses to determine what one is allergic to is a neat diagnosis tool. I'm amazed. Anyway I wanted to tell you all about this now because in case you suffer from anything chronic, it could be from allergies. They even list things like arthritis, chronic fatigue syndrome, heart irregularities, and fibromyalgia, among other things, as likely allergic reactions to something in your food or environment. I wouldn't say anything if this were't impressing the scientist in me. I may not know how it works, but it does. And there are no drugs or invasive procedures involved. I'm impressed so far. The next thing I want to see is next time I take Evan (my son) back to his regular MD allergy doctor, if the skin test comes up negative for the foods he's been treated for so far by NAET. I'll let you know..... Blessings, Date: Sat, 9 May 98 20:31:58 -0600 Happy Mother's Day to all! Love from Kathleen
When God Created Mothers...
Date: Sat, 09 May 1998 21:49:46 -0500 thank you so much for posting this Lori. i am a chronic sufferer of allergies. to practically everything. some people feel depressed or fed up with the physical plane, i just feel like my body is rejecting it. what has michael had to say about allergies? all i've ever read about it was in Messages from Michael where he talks about animal allergies as being 'denials'. denials?? what is that supposed to mean? in those big capital letters it sounds so disturbing. what about food allergies? also, does body type have anything to do with predisposition to allergies? javex. (the one who fears Teletubbies, clowns and Santa Claus). Date: Sat, 09 May 1998 21:58:54 -0700
> thank you so much for posting this Lori.
Thank you Melissa! Well, maybe we *should* eat more brussel sprouts, but hey, I'm all for some of Dave's Ben & Jerry's ice cream. But that's because like him, I'm sensitive to sugar and dairy, which also means, I crave them.
> what has michael had to say about allergies? all i've
I think denials have some merit. But once you've dealt with your emotional issues, and you've kept going and going down your spiritual path and dealing with all your patterns and such, and still, your body is suffering, then what? Why would babies be allergic to so many things? They aren't old enough to have denials--they are very straight forward and don't hold anything back--that's obvious enough to any parent. That's why I don't completely buy the denial thing. It may be one aspect but it doesn't address the physical part of our beings. I can also see that we pass on not only our genetic memories to our children, but there are cellular memories as well. This I've seen now that I've found my own biological family and found out what things they have as emotional patterns and addictions. There are these patterns stored in cellular memory, I'm sure of it. They may have been emotional energy blockages created by the souls of those who were our ancestors, who knows how many generations back. And these blockages were passed down, and this gets very physical, it's beyond the karma concept, but inclusive of it as well. We keep the physical memories of our ancestors and when we cure that physical part, it's not only our emotional patterns that get cleared, it's our ancestors' as well. In this way we work with others on a spiritual as well as a physical level, transcending time and space. You deal with your emotional patterns, but when you've dealt with your own (well, of course this road you go down all your life) and still your body is sick, you need to clear the physical part. I believe that allergies can be traced in emotional patterns of our ancestors as well as ourselves. And we may have been some of the fragments who inhabited some of our ancestor's bodies. So we are healing other lifetimes of ourselves as well.
> what about food allergies?
I read that you crave the foods you are most allergic to. Before now I thought the only way around this was to avoid those foods (which I for one, don't have enough will-power to do, because, I'm not in enough pain--that would motivate me, indeed.) But with this NAET, it seems avoidance is not the only way--you can be cured from your allergy and enjoy the things that used to make you sick.
> also, does body type have anything to do with predisposition to allergies?
Emily Baumbach is writing a book on diseases with some help from Michael, and I remember at the AMT conference, her going over the body types and what foods they should avoid and that they crave (same ones.) Unfortunately, I don't remember all the foods for each body type, but the ones I do recall include how Venusians should avoid too much sugar and alchohol, Jovians should avoid just plain eating too much, Lunars should avoid a lot of mucous-producing foods like dairy products. I don't remember any of the others. But like I said, avoidance of the allergenic substance has always been the prescription, but what if you're allergic to the very nutrients your body needs to live? We found out my son and I are allergic to minerals like calcium and iron. And vitamin A. I can believe this because I've always had a problem with swelling joints and muscle cramps when I don't take enough calcium supplements (I have to take more than what the normal daily requirements say in the USRDA.) And we both are slightly anemic so we take extra iron supplements, more than usual. I've had acne since I was 10 and vitamin A is known to be a cure for acne, except that in the high dosage needed for the cure, it's toxic and kills you. That's why they made Accutane, a chemically-altered form of vitamin A that cures acne, which I took last year, and had horrible allergies to it the whole time. Accutane gave me terrible arthritis in my feet, and my eyes and nose were constantly runny. It partially cured my acne, but it has come back some. Anyway, these things are the reason I can believe I have allergies to calcium, iron, and vitamin A. Michael told me in a channeling back in 1994 that my acne was due to a milk allergy. I didn't understand at that time it was the proteins that we are allergic to, and not just the lactose. It's the same with grains and nuts, they have proteins some of us are sensitive to. Besides this, the NAET people say you can be allergic to "anything under the sun, including sunlight itself."
> i am a chronic sufferer of allergies. to practically everything.
Yeah, I'm convinced depression can be from an allergy too. Been there....Just imagine how many of us might be allergic to our own stress hormones. I bet I'm one of those.... Also, I learned it's not the foods themselves or the environmental allergens themselves that produce the toxins in our bodies, it's our bodies' immune system reactions to the allergens that produce the toxins in our bodies that make us sick. Of course there are still chemicals in foods and such that can make you sick too, but I'm just referring to normal foods that shouldn't make you sick. This NAET technique somehow reprograms your immune system to not react to what are normally harmless substances to most people. For children they use just accupressure, and for adults they use both the accupressure and some accupuncture. I had my first treatment yesterday. The practitioner told me as I get more of my own allergies cured, I might not have to take my heart medication anymore, but to go to my doctor about that first. I always hoped there would be some way to cure my tachycardia! Michael never had any answers for me but did tell me once that they thought my heart problem would be cured by the time I was 30. Well that gives me a year now. :) We'll see... Hey, maybe I should write a Michael book about allergies! ;-p
> javex. (the one who fears Teletubbies, clowns and Santa Claus).
Yeah, me too!!!! As a child I used to scream and cry whenever I saw clowns or a Santa Claus! LOL! Love, Date: Sun, 10 May 1998 02:06:13 EDT In a message dated 98-05-10 00:56:01 EDT, Lori writes:
I'm all for some of Dave's Ben & Jerry's ice cream. But that's
Yes, and next month Ben & Jerry are introducing a new flavor I suggested to them called " Vanilla Flavored Scabs and Chocolate Covered Toe Nail Clippings." Hopefully for the sake of my creative career, this will do better than my other products such as, "Snot Slurpees, and Bile Smoothies..." Wish me luck! Seriously, I don't know why my ideas aren't more successful. Dave - I'm just an old soul who taunts the mature souls with the horrifying prospect that they might turn out just like me. ;-p Yep, gang, you know you're an old soul when you can remember a past life when your bible was autographed by the original authors...... Date: Sun, 10 May 1998 02:10:45 EDT In a message dated 98-05-08 12:33:02 EDT, M'Ixchel writes:
Alright Dave...let me have it
Okay, which rat on this list told you about the initiation? There's just no way you could have guessed right on the very first try. ;-p No fair...:-( Dave :) Date: Sun, 10 May 1998 07:25:49 -0500 Lori wrote:
> Know why you can't do it? Because unconditional love is not a mental
I think there is a misunderstanding here (probably caused by me) so I will try to explain what I meant. When I refer to giving unconditional love to others, I am doing what in some metaphysical areas is termed "Practicing The Presence". Through everything we do on the physical plane we are conditioned. It starts at birth and throughout the years we are taught to be judgmental. When I see certain people throughout my workday I have "judgements" that come up, unbidden, from within. This person is rude, that person is overbearing, etcetra. I believe (and perhaps I am wrong, it's been known to happen), that to learn my lessons and achieve my life task I must, to the best of my ability, "unlearn the imprinting". Therefore, I must consciously attempt to see the Essence of each person I interact with. If it is done consciously often enough, it becomes a part of you; i.e., reprogramming the imprinting. I hope that this is a better explanation of what I do. And please do not think I am condescending to those of you who are much younger than I am, when I say that when each of you reaches the "fifth monad" your viewpoint will in some degree or other change. My apologies to Dave. It's unfair of me to expect any of you who are much younger, chronologically, to see from my perspective. You are addressing the issues from your perspective and just as a Young Soul sees the world from one viewpoint and an Old Soul from another, a young person, chronologically, sees things differently than those of us who are in the twilight of a lifetime. I am not putting anyone down. We are all exactly where we are supposed to be and while I am sometimes world weary, you are living "life" to the fullest. I "Have" been there and I "Have" done that, and I would not deny any of you your opportunity to enjoy it. But please allow me my perspective. You might even learn something of what lies ahead and it might one day help you. (I doubt it, though, it's never helped my child when I warn him that he is making a mistake I once made.) We all get to tramp through the fields of experience ourselves. My apologies if I offended anyone and I'm joyful if any of you find something of value in this post. Love Jeanne
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